Engine failure

[Ken Bylund]

I have a 2016ED which I purchase new, my motor went with 12200 miles. After doing a little investigating I was overwhelmed with the number of engine failures with low mileage. The one comment that bothered me the most was Your we’re lucky! Anybody out there in the same boat!

 

[SeanPwnery]

The failure is generally caused by the EGR system sending soot down the intake, which will eventually clog up the runners, work its way down to the cylinders, score the walls, get down into your oil pan, clog up the main bearings, and seize up the engine. This is what happens when idiots with little to no engineering expertise at the EPA that know nothing about diesel engines decide to force manufacturer's to add systems intended for gasoline engines without knowing the detriment they're about to cause the industry just to possibly save Johnny Polar bear. If you want to see a complete teardown of said carnage, feast your eyes on this. That guy didn't know the cause, but plenty of people left the culprit in the comments.

As many will tell you here, if you get the engine replaced via warranty - delete everything. EGR, DPF, DEF injection system. These 2nd-gen ED's can be made reliable once all of that garbage is removed. If you're in a hawkish inspection state, you might look into 3rd party tunes that simply disable the EGR (I'll likely go this route at first).

 

[autoX]

It's a pretty spectacular system of high quality components and software that make up any SCR/DEF/EGR system. And the results are very effective in terms of pollutant reduction . Unfiltered diesel emissions are a serious health issue. That's the reason for all the complexity. The 3.0L is a strong motor and from what I can see, looks to be well-designed.

The problem: I don't think it's recirculated soot that's the issue. Why not just one bearing or camshaft wear or lube failure in other areas? These are bottom-end crank failures indicating overload conditions and mechanical distortion imo.

Operating conditions are out of tolerance for the motor, presented in the field, which is worse case scenario for FCA. Points to inadequate or insufficient testing.

Yeah so we are owners of the "global inventory" of these trucks and as much as I hate to do it, delete is the best option. This is to reduce low-end crankshaft distortion by eliminating exhaust restriction. Stinky operation but fuel econ is insane. I got 8.5 L/100km on a long trip. You can offset your stinky diesel use by cycling or using a small car when you can.

PJ P.Eng.!

 

[TC Diesel]

AutoX, Thats Your Opinion or someone's advertising..... These Near to PPM NOx and Soot levels are not Needed, DO the Math If you allowed just Single Digit PPMs it would take 27 million 3.0s-15L DSL's to equal 1 3hr lighting storm levels. The EPA current levels are NOT needed for the Earth to support life....or clean environment.

 

[DATA]

AutoX, Thats Your Opinion or someone's advertising..... These Near to PPM NOx and Soot levels are not Needed, DO the Math If you allowed just Single Digit PPMs it would take 27 million 3.0s-15L DSL's to equal 1 3hr lighting storm levels. The EPA current levels are NOT needed for the Earth to support life....or clean environment.

TC do you think the biggest cause of the problems with the Eco engine is the EGR cooler?

 

[TC Diesel]

Data NO on rotating mass Failures, Yes on the fires, leaks , Plenum , Turbo , Warped Valves. It simply is Hero Zero motor, But it has extremely high failure rates on Components, like Tone Ring / Crank sensor , Glow plugs , Turbo , DPF, etc. It's just European Design, Over Engineered and under developed, The USA DSL Engines like the D-Max LML / L5P and the Ford 6.7 both have this overall design... The Cummins , Volvo's , Detroit Motors are designed for long term ownership, You can Replace the EGR valve , Cooler , Bypass in Less than 70 minutes on any Ram 6.7 Cummins, it takes 2-3+ hrs on D-Max / Ford plus $100.00s more for components. Alot of the Failures are clearly the burden of the EPA Near 0 requirements, Most Powerplant MFG have EGR less engines available, that do away with external EGR, that near 0 levels of NOx can be achieved, but the EPA considers the EGR components as (AECDs) So the engines cannot be (COC).

 

[DATA]

Data NO on rotating mass Failures, Yes on the fires, leaks , Plenum , Turbo , Warped Valves. It simply is Hero Zero motor, But it has extremely high failure rates on Components, like Tone Ring / Crank sensor , Glow plugs , Turbo , DPF, etc. It's just European Design, Over Engineered and under developed, The USA DSL Engines like the D-Max LML / L5P and the Ford 6.7 both have this overall design... The Cummins , Volvo's , Detroit Motors are designed for long term ownership, You can Replace the EGR valve , Cooler , Bypass in Less than 70 minutes on any Ram 6.7 Cummins, it takes 2-3+ hrs on D-Max / Ford plus $100.00s more for components. Alot of the Failures are clearly the burden of the EPA Near 0 requirements, Most Powerplant MFG have EGR less engines available, that do away with external EGR, that near 0 levels of NOx can be achieved, but the EPA considers the EGR components as (AECDs) So the engines cannot be (COC).

Do you think the new GEN three engine with all the updates is a far better engines in then the Gen 2. Thank you

 

[TC Diesel]

NO, its just more complex and will cost More $$$ in future repairs, It likely will extend those failures maybe 25/75K miles more but it will still happen, Plus the engine is out of Production... So Parts will be less available and cost more.. No need to produce more components when the engine ends production. Thers NO millions of VM 3.0 like Cummins and others.

 

[DATA]

NO, its just more complex and will cost More $$$ in future repairs, It likely will extend those failures maybe 25/75K miles more but it will still happen, Plus the engine is out of Production... So Parts will be less available and cost more.. No need to produce more components when the engine ends production. Thers NO millions of VM 3.0 like Cummins and others.

So if a person wants to stick with the fuel mileage and a half ton diesel you would have to go to a GMC or Chevrolet. do you know if that little Duramax engine is any more reliable than the eco-diesel? Thanks again

 

[TC Diesel]

Why Diesel?...in 1/2 ton power Diesel is not needed, the new Hurricane motor will pencil better than any 1/2 ton Diesel...My 2019 5.7L limited gets great MPG...18,21 HWY, 14,16 city..@ $2.75 PG..Diesel $4.40 PG.

 

[DATA]

Why Diesel?...in 1/2 ton power Diesel is not needed, the new Hurricane motor will pencil better than any 1/2 ton Diesel...My 2019 5.7L limited gets great MPG...18,21 HWY, 14,16 city..@ $2.75 PG..Diesel $4.40 PG.

Yeah I thought about that hurricane motor. I’ll see you when I get it in one and a half ton pick ups. What the true fuel mileage will be. Thank you for all your replies today. And have a happy new year

 

[DATA]

Why Diesel?...in 1/2 ton power Diesel is not needed, the new Hurricane motor will pencil better than any 1/2 ton Diesel...My 2019 5.7L limited gets great MPG...18,21 HWY, 14,16 city..@ $2.75 PG..Diesel $4.40 PG.

One other question I’m not really looking for power and for that heavier towing. Have you had anybody that you know that has had the 3.6 pin star with the VVT. How they liked it and what kind of real true fuel mileage they got? thanks

 

[autoX]

Replying to TC - If you re-read I am referring to health, respiratory issues. I like to breathe clean air and this deleted EcoD is not that. At a doc's place yesterday and he runs marine diesels we had this discussion.

Back to failure and why, from I do cars (which I watch quite a bit) the crank is failure along the support line of crank. The root cause is not lubrication failure but it's overloaded, causing all bearings to move past their spec and fail. The Range Rover TDV6 cranks snap. Might be something with a V6 config. There is a lot of leverage on a connecting rod that is why I think if a power-stroke is fighting the exhaust stroke you are adding to the load issue.

 

[TC Diesel]

Naa AutoX....I want clean air also...The requirements (some) are necessary for clean air, it's the extremes that are NOT.... Near 0 NOx is extreme, in venting AECD mandatory are NOT needed for clean Air that CAA laws do NOT require...its a handful of NUT Cases/Jobs that cannot remove the EPA blinders, and allow what's needed to keep the environment livable and clean forever.

Your 7 years late to the party, If the Fake News site has not deleted My 2015 posting on failures and why, everything I forecasted ( and I mean everything) happened to VM 3.0 Years in advance...... By the WAY the EPA agree with Me 2 Years after I posted VM 3.0s AECDs are tuned conditional events.

 

[SeanPwnery]

So if a person wants to stick with the fuel mileage and a half ton diesel you would have to go to a GMC or Chevrolet. do you know if that little Duramax engine is any more reliable than the eco-diesel? Thanks again

I think it was another thread on these forums, but it was confirmed that GM owns 50% of VM Motari, and their logo was on the oil caps. The 2.8L Duramax is their collab engine too. The thing I find a little strange is these engines on the other side of the pond supposedly don't have the multitude of issues they have here in North America. It's a lot like what happened with the Fiat 500's with manual transmissions (I had one of those before too). Everything "changed" on our models were the cause of all the problems, failures, and in my case, TWO clutch recalls in less than 30k miles. I'm going to stick by my original earlier statement - the EPA may have a few "engineers" but they're clearly verseless in diesel technology, or the detriment of force feeding soot down the intakes of these things.

I'd love to see a long-term report on what a brand new, crate and fully deleted 3-liter is capable of with a solid tune, and updated fuel map.

 

[TC Diesel]

No, GM and Motori jointly Developed the VM 3.0 for Euro Caddy's That never went into production 2004-08 GM , 2007 GM acquires 50% of Motori, 2011 Fiat Purchases Penskes stake, Thus becoming the Other 50% Owner, Fiat Purchase the rest of Motori becoming wholly owned by Fiat 2014. Today Motori is Leaving On-road engines to build Industrial and Marine powerplants.....

 

[autoX]

Speaking of GM the new Z0? engine and the previous LM2 seem to be doing OK. In-line 6 which makes sense, but some workarounds to package /fit.

The full delete on the EcoD is pretty nice. Drives great, using it everyday now.
From VM Motori website: We are available to evaluate specific solutions for special vehicle applications for a power range up to 250CV if our standard product range is not a satisfactory solution for customer needs.

 

[TC Diesel]

VM MOTORI...is leaving / stopping production on on road power plant...