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FCA insider document reveals current engine failure rate.

M

MSP548

Active Member
Aug 30, 2016
202
62
Truck Year
2016
As I was visiting some of my favorite EcoDiesel information websites, I stumbled across an insider FCA document which revealed the current 3.0 VM failure rate at an average of 19 per WEEK. The same insider document was posted a few months back. At that time, the failure rate was 16 per week. The average failure rate has risen 15% without adding a single additional vehicle to the 104,000 '14-'16's sold.

If these numbers aren't alarming on their own; consider this... Also posted as a comparison was an FCA insider document revealing the current weekly average engine failure rate of the Cummins utilized in the 2500/3500/4500's. The number is 2. That is an average of two engines per week in a market that dwarfs the measly 104,000 EcoDiesel market. Not only that, but the Cummins market grows by the hundreds every day with the sale of new vehicles while the Ecodiesel has not sold a '17 model year vehicle to date.

Folks, if you don't think this problem is growing out of control, I don't know what to say to you. For the rest of you, I would suggest signing up for the class action lawsuit. We all own toxic property with abnormally low resale value. FCA should be held accountable for our monetary losses (both realized and future losses). In other words, buybacks based on book value at the time the news of the diesel cheat broke as early as September '16.
 
Brady

Brady

Well-Known Member
Jun 7, 2015
1,051
424
Truck Year
2015
Reads like a lawyer trying to drum up business. Pass.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
 
Brady

Brady

Well-Known Member
Jun 7, 2015
1,051
424
Truck Year
2015
MSP548 said:
As I was visiting some of my favorite EcoDiesel information websites, I stumbled across an insider FCA document which revealed the current 3.0 VM failure rate at an average of 19 per WEEK. The same insider document was posted a few months back. At that time, the failure rate was 16 per week. The average failure rate has risen 15% without adding a single additional vehicle to the 104,000 '14-'16's sold.

If these numbers aren't alarming on their own; consider this... Also posted as a comparison was an FCA insider document revealing the current weekly average engine failure rate of the Cummins utilized in the 2500/3500/4500's. The number is 2. That is an average of two engines per week in a market that dwarfs the measly 104,000 EcoDiesel market. Not only that, but the Cummins market grows by the hundreds every day with the sale of new vehicles while the Ecodiesel has not sold a '17 model year vehicle to date.

Folks, if you don't think this problem is growing out of control, I don't know what to say to you. For the rest of you, I would suggest signing up for the class action lawsuit. We all own toxic property with abnormally low resale value. FCA should be held accountable for our monetary losses (both realized and future losses). In other words, buybacks based on book value at the time the news of the diesel cheat broke as early as September '16.
Click to expand...
I'm really not debating the reliability between the power plants as the Cummins seems to be as well built as they come, and it's apparent a certain percentage of failures plaque VM. Nevertheless, maybe I need help understanding some things...

Take the same problem with both engines, say a spun bearing; are they both remedied by total engine replacement? Can it be just more cost effective to replace the entire 3.0L vs shop time rebuilding the engine whereas the 6.7L would be rebuilt? Both are failures, but only one requires a crate engine that would show on these reports. Maybe there's something to that, I don't know.

As far as joining that lawsuit? It's something I couldn't rightly join as I in no way bought this truck based on its tailpipe emissions. Now if a software fix that kills mileage and reduces engine life is mandatory to get it registered, then yea, we can talk about compensation.

If we are suing because of a 'claimed' higher than standard engine failure rate, I'm not buying that either. From what I gather, the warranty is good. FCA is stepping up when they need to be. Nowhere are we guaranteed the truck won't fail us. So what are we entitled to?

Don't take this as cheerleading. I don't claim anything is the greatest ever. I need way more then 45k miles on the clock to declare that. But I do think, given the nature of forums and social media today, that things are blown way out of proportion.

Just thinking out loud here.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
 
Brady

Brady

Well-Known Member
Jun 7, 2015
1,051
424
Truck Year
2015
Paulkeemon said:
Where's the document???
Click to expand...
Harvested from another forum.
dcb8aeffc47267f688d6f4f8a56d8a97.jpg
26699726cca4baf0d0d47891a7da2e4a.jpg


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
 
M

MSP548

Active Member
Aug 30, 2016
202
62
Truck Year
2016
Yes, those are the documents I was referring to. I just was not being more specific out of respect to BoostN.

The problem I have is that I don't see a date anywhere on those forms to tell us the sample period. If someone else does, please enlighten me.

Also, as an aside, I hear people talk a lot about the generousity of FCA in regards to them standing by their warranty. Let me ask this, If I told you I would pay the doctor bill and compensate you for lost work; would you let me kick you in the nuts as hard as I can? Same difference to me.
 
Last edited:
Brady

Brady

Well-Known Member
Jun 7, 2015
1,051
424
Truck Year
2015
MSP548 said:
Also, as an aside, I hear people talk a lot about the generousity of FCA in regards to them standing by their warranty. Let me ask this, If I told you I would pay the doctor bill and compensate you for lost work; would you let me kick you in the nuts as hard as I can? Same difference to me.
Click to expand...

Haha that's a terrible analogy. We haven't even concluded what percentage of these motors have failed. And to top it off, yours, mine, TCs, Jeffs, and the overwhelmingly majority of EcoDs out there are problem free.

Standing by their warranty isn't generosity, it's expected. Simply stated, they are backing their product as they should.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
 
D

David Duncan

New Member
Aug 10, 2017
7
5
Truck Year
2015
How long will the replacement engines be warranted for? Mine had almost 35k miles on it when it died! Is this engine problem going to kill our resale value? Are they replacement engines any better than the crap they came with? Such as have they figured out the failure problem and made changes to the engines? I was a huge ecodiesel fan until mine died!
Just thinking out loud! Welcome for any input!
 
B

Brian Hartenstine

New Member
Nov 11, 2015
12
2
Truck Year
2015
Brady said:
I'm really not debating the reliability between the power plants as the Cummins seems to be as well built as they come, and it's apparent a certain percentage of failures plaque VM. Nevertheless, maybe I need help understanding some things...

Take the same problem with both engines, say a spun bearing; are they both remedied by total engine replacement? Can it be just more cost effective to replace the entire 3.0L vs shop time rebuilding the engine whereas the 6.7L would be rebuilt? Both are failures, but only one requires a crate engine that would show on these reports. Maybe there's something to that, I don't know.

As far as joining that lawsuit? It's something I couldn't rightly join as I in no way bought this truck based on its tailpipe emissions. Now if a software fix that kills mileage and reduces engine life is mandatory to get it registered, then yea, we can talk about compensation.

If we are suing because of a 'claimed' higher than standard engine failure rate, I'm not buying that either. From what I gather, the warranty is good. FCA is stepping up when they need to be. Nowhere are we guaranteed the truck won't fail us. So what are we entitled to?

Don't take this as cheerleading. I don't claim anything is the greatest ever. I need way more then 45k miles on the clock to declare that. But I do think, given the nature of forums and social media today, that things are blown way out of proportion.

Just thinking out loud here.



Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
I have a 2015 Limited with over 60,000 miles and no issues, I want to tune and have talked to green diesel but haven't pulled the trigger yet, trying to get the service to agree not to flash the PCM.
 
jdn112011

jdn112011

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2015
1,253
344
Truck Year
2015
Brady said:
Harvested from another forum.
dcb8aeffc47267f688d6f4f8a56d8a97.jpg
26699726cca4baf0d0d47891a7da2e4a.jpg


Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G891A using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
If suggested retail price of the engine is $2,993.30 who the fuck cares? That's the cheapest light duty diesel out of the crate you'll find. I can imagine 4cyl going for more. Compare that price to the alleged Cummins part number at $8,428?

Total engine failure out of Warranty, $3k brand new factory crate motor, wrench on it yourself, bring to dealer for necessary software synchronization at the end.
 
M

MSP548

Active Member
Aug 30, 2016
202
62
Truck Year
2016
jdn112011 said:
If suggested retail price of the engine is $2,993.30 who the fuck cares? That's the cheapest light duty diesel out of the crate you'll find. I can imagine 4cyl going for more. Compare that price to the alleged Cummins part number at $8,428?

Total engine failure out of Warranty, $3k brand new factory crate motor, wrench on it yourself, bring to dealer for necessary software synchronization at the end.
Click to expand...
LOL LOL LOL

Call your dealer and ask prices. LOL
 
J

jpap2418

New Member
Mar 3, 2016
19
7
Truck Year
2020
Has any one looked up that part number to see what it corresponds to. Maybe just the short block?
 
K

KrayLock

New Member
Aug 24, 2017
4
0
Truck Year
2014
Mine just self destructed at 105,000 miles.
Dealer quoted $5,090 for a new long block and $2,300 for labor.
Working with service manager to see what happened and possibly opening a case with FCA
 
jdn112011

jdn112011

Well-Known Member
Oct 18, 2015
1,253
344
Truck Year
2015
KrayLock said:
Mine just self destructed at 105,000 miles.
Dealer quoted $5,090 for a new long block and $2,300 for labor.
Working with service manager to see what happened and possibly opening a case with FCA
Click to expand...
To be completely honest, I'm surprised that quote isn't the other way around
 
BoostN

BoostN

Administrator
Staff member
Administrator
Jul 27, 2013
4,315
1,136
Truck Year
Not Listed
KrayLock said:
Mine just self destructed at 105,000 miles.
Dealer quoted $5,090 for a new long block and $2,300 for labor.
Working with service manager to see what happened and possibly opening a case with FCA
Click to expand...

Welcome to the forum KrayLock.

Are you the original owner? What maintenance procedures did you follow?
 
K

KrayLock

New Member
Aug 24, 2017
4
0
Truck Year
2014
Bought it pre-owned last year (2016) with 65,000 miles.
It was Certified with 100,000 powertrain warranty.
Most of the miles I added were highway with no towing.
I had the dealership do my scheduled oil changes as they were included with the purchase.
 
BoostN

BoostN

Administrator
Staff member
Administrator
Jul 27, 2013
4,315
1,136
Truck Year
Not Listed
KrayLock said:
Bought it pre-owned last year (2016) with 65,000 miles.
It was Certified with 100,000 powertrain warranty.
Most of the miles I added were highway with no towing.
I had the dealership do my scheduled oil changes as they were included with the purchase.
Click to expand...

5K out of warranty is just bad luck.

Keep us updated, maybe the dealership will help you out?
 
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